2/6
Disclaimer:
This is my editing, so there could be some misunderstandings.
Anyone who wants to read everything should go to the 'spec' of Paracosm discord.
I think Hans's philosophy and determination is worth sharing and spreading widely among iota community.
Thanks for all the members contributing this inspiring conversation.
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 7:43
The way it looks to me is:
The unclaimed tokens went back to the issuer (as clearly stated in the bitcointalk thread: https://puu.sh/F79rk/ade621ced1.png) so nobody can claim that they were "unrightfully taken". It was very clear that these would be "donations", which can mean pretty much anything. David could have just taken the money and left. Instead he used these funds to establish the hardware side of IOTA research - JINN. I guess cfb was okay with david having the tokens because after all they were fighting for a common cause - the success of the IOTA protocol and as long as the funds are used to help the tech it doesn't really matter who has the keys, right (by that time they most probably felt like they are a "team")?
David most probably ended up being the one responsible because somebody just had to do the stupid job of setting up the company and everything to make it legally correct - nobody knew that it would be worth millions of dollars then.
Now that JINN went belly up due to personal issues that we all know, cfb claims that half of these "donations" (or all?) belong to him personally and that David owes him these funds. I am having a hard time understanding the reasoning behind this, as the funds were obviously always considered to be used to "help the IOTA ecosystem". This is also what David has now officially claimed to do - use these funds to support IOTA.
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 7:45
"Legally" its his tokens and he could use them for whatever he wants - he could have bought a villa on a nice little beach but instead he used these funds to invest them back to IOTA.
Legally its donations to the issuer of the tokens, he can do with it whatever the fuck he wants
from the very first day he received them
because JINN was meant to benefit IOTA and he payed researchers and engineers and whatnot
these "donations" were like 10k$ back then
it very much sounded like these funds were supposed to be used as some form of "strategic investment into the future of IOTA"
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 7:49
I wrote "The way it looks to me is:" how does that drag the foundation into anything
its an opinion
i will not stop having opinions just because I happen to work for the IF
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 7:57
People are more motivated then ever
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:02
the point is that the IF is not going to be there forever - its not meant to
having a self sustainable ecosystem is very important for the maturity of the protocol
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:03
No it's not
if IF would cease to exist tomorrow - it would be finished by the people working for the IF anyway
I am 100% sure
and if i would have to do it alone ...
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:05
we can all do it together - and we are actually doing it already
hornet and goshimmer have VERY close ties
they are really good friends and very capable coders
its an honor to work with them
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:06
[when do you reckon the shift to binary will take place?]
its being merged in goshimmer tomorrow :smile:
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:14
[about Multiverse]
the last statements of popov was that it "might work"
he still has some concerns
i guess he still tends to think the chances of it not working as bigger than the chances of it working
I am 100% sure it works - but maybe its on me to prove that with a fully functional prototype.
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:17
My goal is to show a prototype being able to process 10 million tps by the mid of this year - we will see if I can pull this off
maybe time will be rare, considering the parallel work on coordicide
maybe I should aim for end of 2020 instead
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:19
of course it includes sharding
that whole point of IOTA is sharding
and a completely new form of sharding
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:19
[why 10m TPS?]
its just a random number
some kind of goal post
so you can process the entirety of bitcoins history in 1minute and 30 seconds?
would be a nice thing
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:21
coordicide and multiverse would essentially use the same sharding principles
I hope that we can share more on that soon
Oh its quite concrete
we are starting to write math papers about it already
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:23
FPC is perfectly fine for sharding
you have to forget the discrete sharding world of blockchains where you just make n copies of the same thing
its very different
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:25
[did you look at radix for inspiration (for sharding)]
not really
i mean yeah I've read some convos and stuff
radix abandoned the DAG because they didn't see a very simple solution to one of the problems
and they still don't see it
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:30
I would LOVE to share that with you but maybe just wait a but longer - we will be more open about this pretty soon
let's just say that we still have some aces in our sleeves
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:49
nope
I am completely new in crypto but I am pretty sure that some people might "know me from before"
if they would know what I did before
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 8:57
dude the IF has reached a stage where it would survive without anbybody
I could drop dead tomorrow and the IF would continue, same goes for David or anybody else
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:00
all the corporates and everything ... it might not be fully reflected in the price yet but IOTA has a really really bright future
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:01
I think we are starting to see a pretty bullish sentiment around IOTA lately
I only hope that its due to our increased transparency with a clear roadmap and everyhting, and not just some random fluke in the prices
It would just feel much more "rewarding" to be a consequence of our efforts :joy:
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:05
i am buying more IOTA every month : was very happy about the low prices
but I can understand that if you just "have to believe" and have no insight about the actual progress, then these prices can feel more concerning than a "bargain"
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:13
Do you really expect a guy working on IOTA to not be bullish about the tech and everything?
I am not in IOTA for the moneyzzz
I have more FIAT than i will ever need in a lifetime
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:18
if you are asking for investment advice, then I am most probably the worst person to ask
as my trades in crypto have always been horrible
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:20
I didn't have the chance to be around in the ICO days so I need to take what's left
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:24
I earned my money outside of crypto
it's a "open secret" among the people who know
but it doesn't matter anyway
who cares what people did in their past - the only thing is what they do now!
btw. I didn't do any bad things like killing people or sth - just to be clear lol
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:27
I don't know man - everybody that I know is not willing to sell
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:35
Yassin is the proof that "reputation" is worth something
A man of honor - my deepest respect to you man
People who stick to their word and can be trusted are sadly a rare thing in today's world
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:39
I anyway think that we have way too much tribalism in crypto
people should really stop praising "people and projects" and instead start to praise ideas and concepts
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:43
I mean I get the whole concept of having a single currency and shit, but if the tech is bad? I mean this is the first time in the history of humans that we can "design" the very foundation of our social and economical layer
why would we not go for the best available tech?
bitcoin was "a breakthrough" when it was released
and it helped to kickstart a whole field of research
but its clearly not the best possible solution
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:47
ultimately the best tech will win
just look at bitcoins dominance
its fading long term
sure it was time for a correction from the 2017 run of alts
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:47
but the overall trend is pretty clear
bitcoins days are numbered
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:50
[you could draw the same line regarding IOTAs market dominance]
IOTA had a crazy run in 2017 and I would even claim to a large degree underserved
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:54
maybe I can leak one thing about IOTA's sharding solution without giving away too much: Every single node can individually decide how much data it wants to process - so you can have very very resource-constrained nodes like sensors and stuff in the same network as nodes with hundreds of cores and they will be able to work together seamlessly
there will essentially be no "minimum hardware requirements" for a node (of course you have "some" requirements to even be able to run some kind of logic)
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:56
We are on the forefront of research when it comes to VDF's but its not really related
VDFs would maybe be a way to replace PoW in the future as a rate control mechanism
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 9:58
you don't need big nodes
you can be as big as you want to be
but naturally some nodes will have more power than others
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:01
possible - the whole mana system is based on "reputation", if you run a reliable cluster of nodes that people are willing to use, then you can earn mana
and since mana decides how many transactions you can issue, you can of course "allow others to use your resources" for money
so operating a reliable node cluster could be sth that people might do "for a living" in the future
maybe it would be best to build up a reputation already today
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:03
if you have funds in the network, then you will generate more than enough mana to have enough "shares" in the network to use it
for free
but if anybody wants to just piggyback on the network without holding tokens, then he might have to pay a "fee"
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:05
if you want to send a lot of data transactions, then you better have some tokens
I mean its just fair, right?
you don't have any stake in the network but you wanna use it? then pay for it
but people who have funds in the network can use it for free
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:07
i think ultimately the community will provide a plugin for the nodes, where you can "automatically" rent your excess reputation for some income
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:08
[what would the income be ?]
tokens
IOTA
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:09
by the people who want to use the network more than what their token holding would allow them to
so they rent "mana" from the people who have it
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:10
the internet took off when flat-rate emerged
and prices became predictable
the same is true for crypto
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:11
thats why companies like IOTA so much ... it creates a platform that has "predictable" prices
any mining based crypto will never be able to offer the same
Beeing feeless is not just a "funny feature", its the key to mass adoption
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:14
If I run a node and have funds in the network, then why would I pay anybody anything? I am supporting the network already by using it
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:16
Yeah we are using "mana 2" now which is also the one that is implemented in the goshimmer mana package
the formulas are going to change a bit tho
we had like 16 different versions of mana with all very different implications on game theory and code
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:18
but serguei is the expert when it comes to game theory and we are pretty confident that we have chosen the correct survivor
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:19
[The mana implementation does seem like the slipperiest slope]
it uses a few economic theories from the early 20th century (from silvio gesell) by having smth like a "demurrage function"
so the rich dont get richer
its software - if any design decision turns out to be problematic, you patch it
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:20
[So it’s hard to maintain a high mana]
its not like you have to live with it for thousands of years like in our current FIAT system
if you make it right from the start, the rich will never become that powerful that they could even dare to fork
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:22
you are "RENTING" out your excess resources
that doesn't mean that you will broadcast everything unseen
If somebody tries to use your node to perform an attack you will just ignore it
of course you might "lose the fees" that they would be willing to pay you to perform this attack,
but ultimately you will have to decide what is more valuable to you
the few cents of IOTA you earn or your "reputation / mana"
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:25
the nodes will perform all of the sanity checks, so they don't "accidently" take part in an attack of course
the point is that its a voting system based on mana
if I use your node to "issue a transaction",
then I maybe pay you for issuing this tx
but your "opinion on that tx" is independent of that
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:29
actually I even think that the whole coordicide principles especially in connection with the sharding are very much in line with cfb's initial vision - and I am actually a bit sad that he never really dared to honestly look into them
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:29
I was even thinking about "naming" the multiverse "cfbs vision" once
maybe its more (pauls's vision) than cfbs vision
paul handy was one of the other early developers of IOTA btw.
and a very very smart person I have to say
a lot of the ideas that we are currently pursuing go back to his line of thinking
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:32
the infamous "ontology principles"
the ultimate goal is to be able to run "anything" on the tangle - not just value transfers but literally anything, event remotely related to DLT's
I envision IOTA being a general purpose DLT platform
pretty much like TCP/IP was for the internet
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:36
I introduced "broadcasts" a few days ago as a new concept that is the equivalent of UDP messages
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:49
I think that one of the things where cfb and me disagree regarding the "vision of IOTA" is that he think thats we should "finalize" the protocol as soon as possible (or "set it in stone" as he likes to call it), so hardware manufacturer can start to build hardware, whereas I think that it makes much more sense for it to be something like an "open evolving standard" that is so flexible that you can literally build whatever the fuck you want based on this protocol.
The internet wouldn't have been the internet, if it would have "just" been for sending scientific messages between researchers.
I can not anticipate and know what humans might do with DLT in the future, so limiting myself to "only value transfers" is IMHO the wrong decision.
for something to be successful, it needs to be able to "model" everything that could possibly exist
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:51
IOTA will be able to run "anything" on top of it - even "virtual instances of other cryptocurrencies"
and its not going to be some quirky slow emulation - it would most probably even be faster and more reliable than when being implemented without it
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:52
similar to "INTEL inside" you will most probably see sth like "Tangle inside" soon
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:54
"any application" running on top of the tangle (MAM, DID, Qubic, Matrix ... you name them) would ALWAYS have to be able to process IOTA value transfers
THAT's what will give the token a value
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:55
if everybody can already "speak the same language" anyway, then people will also use that language to communicate
which means that people will use the IOTA token to transfer value
so we don't need to "force ourselves" on others - they will come by themselves
because its the only thing that makes sense
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 10:57
[so Hans, $10 EOY still ?]
if btc stays where it is?
hard to achieve i'd say
most probably not
it always takes some time for people to "wake up"
dunno maybe it goes fast
most weak hands are gone in IOTA
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 11:00
But seriously guys ... the price of course is interesting but if we are able to pull this off, then this will be the start of a new form of society
it will affect everything
the way we interact .... even the way we behave towards each other
I am not even sure if you need to be "rich" in that kind of society
Star trek sounds like a nice vision
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 11:13
There are plenty of projects that are "interesting" for some of their research topics
but nothing that achieves what I "need to see" from a crypto to qualify as "groundbreaking enough"
MAYBE radix, if they have what they claim to have
but even what I "assume" what they have, is not better than IOTA
especially regarding sharding
and that's what they claim to be "good at"
it will all become quite obvious, once we reveal more details regarding sharding
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 11:20
[once IOTA is completely implemented, its gonna be a matter of energy consumption optimization race I guess?]
ultimately, yes
whatever crypto is going to be the "cheapest" one to "operate" will win
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 11:22
BUT that is at the same time "expressive" enough to not have "niches" for weird competitors, that claim to be even a "little bit better" in one of the aspects
it needs to be the best possible solution that humans are most probably able to come up with
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 11:23
if even the smallest something can be improved, then it should become part of the core rather than a competing project
not having miners and being able to "upgrade" whenever it is necessary, is what will give IOTA power
not setting stuff in stone today
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 11:29
I guess what fascinates me the most about IOTA is that people have a different kind of philosophy - in crypto people are usually sharing the mindset of "let's destroy the banks ... or .... the FED ... or whoever they consider to be their enemy
IOTA for me is not so much about "destroying somebody else" rather than "creating something new"
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 11:30
But the "mindset and motivation" makes all the difference
And I feel like large parts of the community "understand and share" that vision
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 11:34
there are plenty of "problems" where DLT is not the right answer
but there are most probably also quite a few that we haven't even thought about, yet
that go way beyond just "finance"
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 11:38
[Has IF any plans for anonymous transactions Hans?]
it's current not our main point of research but I would say ultimately yes
the fact thats its feeless make "mixing" funds a very feasible solution
But even on top of that (like zero knowledge proofs and stuff) If there is a use case, then you should be able to do it with IOTA.
that's what I mean with "general purpose DLT" platform
whatever is possible should be doable with the protocol - not "just" IoT value transfers
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 11:42
everything you could most probably think of
the same way as TCP/IP allows you to play computer games, send emails, or watch streams
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오전 11:48
tomorrow I start merging the first ledger-related stuff into the development branch
from the outside it will most probably look like any other day : but starting to work on the "final version" which is supposed to be ready end of Q1 is a big milestone for us
2 months left
Hans Moog [IF]어제 오후 12:04
100% agree - let's finish this shit!
we have "talked" for quite a while - the coming months, we will have to show what we "have"
No comments:
Post a Comment